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Small SUV with smooth ride

The Right Car for Me | TrueDelta

joba48

Considering CRV, CX5, RAV4. Would like a smooth ride, leather, heated seats and slider. I have had a RAV4 for many years, but I don't think the quality is there like it used to be. I would like as much luxury as possible for my budget. Real leather, not faux.

Priorities: Handling / Interior styling / Driving position & visibility

Need minimum of 5 seats

Will consider both new and used cars
Maximum mileage: 15000
Maximum age: 1 years

Maximum price: US $ 30000

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Response from NormT

12:08 pm August 23, 2017

At $30,000 for a 2016 the quietest and smoothest would be a Buick Envision Premium l. With it's Hyperstrut from suspension and among the twin-clutch AWD it achieved 55.5 mph in Consumer Reports emergency test or on par with Porsche Macan and Jaguar F-pace. Along with handling it has the best braking for it's segment according to Car & Driver testing. It is also quieter than a Lexus RX according to C&D.

It has real leather seats with heat front and rear, along with heated leather steering wheel. The tri-zone climate control will have you not freezing yourself while trying to keep your rear passengers cool like most of the otherSUVs. The HUD-heads up display is a nice feature where I keep the speedometwrfloating low on the windshield.

At $29,000 the Envision is over $10,000 less expensive than a Lexus NX200T where some of the options are not available at any price but are offered on the Buick.

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Buick Envision
Kia Sorento

Response from donbien

10:32 am August 24, 2017

Consumer Reports did not think highly of the Buick Envision. They said: While it has potential, the Envision isn't fully baked. The crossover falls short on ride comfort, noise isolation, and handling agility.

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Response from danlisahall

3:10 pm August 24, 2017

Norm's recommendations are well written and very thoughtful. After reading his recommendation for the Envsion, I wanted to learn more so Idid a little research in my own. I have not seen nor driven the vehicle.

Edmund's review is generally favorable.Many owner reviews onEdmund strongly dislike theauto stop /engine shut off. Consumer Reports states that despite its features & appear that it is half baked and they advise skipping it.Note that itappears to be made inChina

You could get anew orused,well equipped SubaruOutback 2.5i withall their wonderful new safety features for about $30K including their AWD which is great if you encounter snow. It would lackthe slider door you mentioned so that maybe a deal breaker for you. That said, I don'tthink most of the other vehicles you are considering (CRV & RAV4)have sliders either.We had a 2010 Outback and currently drive a2015 Outback and are very pleased withboth.

Response from NormT

3:52 pm August 24, 2017

Consumer Reports also has the Envision tested doing 55.5 mph in the Emergency Avaoidance test where is within a few tenths of a second to the Jaguar F-Pace and Porsche Macan. No Japanese SUV can match that metric in handling performance.

CR and Car & Driver also recorded very short stopping distances for the Envision, again within feet of the European suvs.

The Envision pricing and most are at MSRP. There are big discounts on 2016 and 2017 Buick Envision which actually undercuts the economy, Japanese cuv go-to that most quote. Most n?e models are close to $10,000 off msrp which makes then less expensive as a near-luxury cuv and less than the economy cuv's. Then you have the longer and better Buick warranty only offered on luxury vehicles.

I think they mentioned sliding rear seat which provides a greater flexibility like moved up to the back of the front seats for our dogs with more rear cargo area or slide back when carrying passengers.

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Response from LectroFuel

10:12 pm August 24, 2017

@donbien I quoted the same statement from CR a couple months ago. They rated it pretty poorly!

I don't know about you, but I care more about the "luxury car" driving like a "luxury car" and not that the "luxury car" successfully swerves at a higher speed. The sliding seats however are a feature people can enjoy. Genesis has a better luxury car warranty, 10/100k. I think a big reason people buy the Japanese CUVs over the Chinese-built Envision is they are already popular. People like and praise them and haven't seen Buick's improvement. Lexus and the German brands have better reputations. I don't usually follow what everyone else does, but that's a reason I wouldn't buy a Buick. I just can't see myself in one.

The $18,000 Toyota Corolla has automatic emergency braking with pedestrian detection, lane departure w/steering assist, auto high beams, and adaptive cruise control standard, but the Envision only comes with auto emergency braking onlyon the $47,000 Premium II which is top of the line. The $15,000 Yaris comes standard with auto emergency braking, lane-departure alert, and auto high beam.

Another CR quote, "Regardless of country of origin, it is clear that he Envision isn't thoroughly developed. Adding insult to injury, there is a disconnect between the price and the car's list of assets and liabilities. For perspective, a $30,000 Ford Escape is more refined and drives dramatically better than the supposedly fancy-pants Envision."

The RAV4 doesn't have the same quality as the Mazda CX-5 or Honda CR-V. Definitely drive those two. They are the top two in the small CUV segment.

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Honda CR-V
Mazda CX-5

Response from NormT

3:56 pm August 25, 2017

We liked the Envision so much we bought one. It is the $49,320 version with everything with only 3,000 miles was $35,000. Can you buy a Japanese CUV with surround camera, Safety Seat, and heads up display for that much? Even Lexus doesn't offer a HUD or Safety Seat.
We rented a 2017 Ford Escape SE AWD for a 6 hour trip to another state to pick up the Buick Envision. I was asking myself what Ford does to the Lincoln to make it quieter, better handling, and better seat cushions. I thought I was going to get tinnitus it was so loud. The throttle was responsive and the brakes were very good, but the steering and and handling was terrible. We did manage 33 mpg with the cruise set at 65 mph though, which was great for AWD and torque converter transmission. My butt was so sore from sitting on 1.3" of seat cushion.
Toyota pedestrian/collision systems do not work. They continue to fail in these tetsts. Here is an example of how they are supposed to work at 2:30 mark
Road Test: 2017 Buick Envision - Give the People What They Want

Response from LectroFuel

1:49 am August 26, 2017

Toyota uses radar for their pre-collision system. Radar waves can't reflect off of cardboard, which was used with the Toyota videos. If there was foil covering the cardboard, it would work because the aluminum reflects the radar waves. The brake sign on the Highlander is most likely the sonar warning the driver. The intelligent clearance sonar auto-brake does not engage over about 10 mph because it is meant for parking collisions.

Motorweek used a different material for testing the Envision, one that is noticed by the radar frequencies and looks like a car. The comparison isn't valid and Toyota's systems do actually work. Why would an automaker sell useless features?

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Response from NormT

7:36 am August 26, 2017

Response from LectroFuel

12:38 am August 27, 2017

I'm quoting my 2016 Prius' owner manual:

"Pre-collision braking


The pre-collision braking function may not operate if certain operations are performed by the driver. If the accelerator pedal is being depressed strongly or the steering wheel is being turned, the system may determine that the driver is taking evasive action and possibly prevent the pre-collision braking function from operating.

In some situations, while the pre-collision braking function is operating, operation of the function may be canceled if the accelerator pedal is depressed strongly or the steering wheel is turned and the system deter- mines that the driver is taking evasive action.

A large amount of braking force is applied while the pre-collision braking function is operating. As the pre-collision braking function will be canceled after the vehicle has been stopped for approximately 2 seconds, the driver should depress the brake pedal as necessary.

If the brake pedal is being depressed, the system may determine that the driver is taking evasive action and possibly delay the operation timing of the pre-collision braking function."

So flooring the gas pedal is actually a safety feature overriding the auto-brake feature. If there is a big truck behind me, I don't want to slam on my brakes because it will hit me. Instead, I can safely swerve or quickly and forcefully depress the gas pedal if I don't want it to auto-brake. My car has braked for me when depressing the gas pedal to a moderate degree. In those videos, the driver took his foot off the gas and the car stopped itself. He never had his foot on the gas while braking, which I think was the opposite of what you were trying to prove. Also, if Toyota's safety system's didn't work there would be lawsuits and tons of complaints.

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Response from NormT

8:24 am August 27, 2017

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